Proton replacement, your best suggestions!
from inlandempire@jlai.lu to privacy@lemmy.ml on 06 Nov 15:01
https://jlai.lu/post/45818039

Edit: I made a mistake, I meant to add Mailfence instead of Fastmail, but forgot to update both the icon and text

Hey everyone, here’s a follow up to my previous post, I tried to summarize all your suggestions and these are the options I have for the main Proton products I’ve been using.

I removed Bitwarden based on your feedback (basically they’re enshittifying).

I’m not including Tuta, because I dislike their UX/UI, also they seem to not apply their LLM policy to their own devs.

I’m not including Mullvlad, because of one of the founder’s donation to a far right political party in Sweden, said founder has a blog post to justify this, which links to another blog post where he claims to be a libertarian anarchist which is just another word for Ancaps which is a dealbreaker for me.

A lot of people recommended using one’s own domain for email stuff, I forgot to mention I do have a custom domain, which will make migrating a lot easier indeed. Just need to update my accounts credentials.

Let me know what you think!

#privacy

threaded - newest

notfromhere@lemmy.ml on 06 Nov 15:11 next collapse

So, guys, I’ve had a pretty great experience with GMail, from a small company… they index the Internet, whatever that means. Anyway, the sign up is free and and I don’t have to bring a domain… again, not sure what that means, but it sounds nice.

inlandempire@jlai.lu on 06 Nov 15:25 collapse

It sounds perfect, I sure hope they’re not evil or something <img alt="doomer" src="https://jlai.lu/pictrs/image/de061376-39e7-4bc0-b17f-a9c39bac50b0.webp">

scytale@piefed.zip on 06 Nov 15:28 next collapse

First time I’ve seen AliasVault. The built-in email server to create aliases and receive email is cool. No need to use a separate service. Can anyone who uses AliasVault share your experience? I know it’s FOSS. I can’t find any info if they’ve been independently audited. If it’s great, I’ll switch from Bitwarden.

tirateimas@lemmy.pt on 06 Nov 15:32 next collapse

Fastmail while an excellent product, is in a jurisdiction with “dubious” rules. I would give Tuta a second chance. Infomaniak is also a good alternative.

inlandempire@jlai.lu on 06 Nov 16:23 collapse

That’s my mistake, I meant to add Mailfence instead of Fastmail, but forgot to update both the icon and text

sidebro@lemmy.zip on 06 Nov 15:49 next collapse

Tuta enjoyer here. Shame you don’t include them.

Einhornyordle@feddit.org on 07 Nov 03:55 collapse

As a fellow Tuta user, I agree, but it really was a mistake that they removed the old premium plan. 12€/year, so 1€/month, was such a good no-brainer deal to completely annihilate the competition, it’s such a shame it’s gone. But at least I got to keep it.

tingly@lemmy.world on 06 Nov 16:26 next collapse

Great list! Thanks for compiling this. AliasVault looks promising.

What are the suggested alternatives to Proton Drive?

inlandempire@jlai.lu on 06 Nov 16:27 next collapse

People mainly suggested either NextCloud or Filen, or you can self host with a NAS too

Worth noting for example Mailbox.org offers some online storage so you might find an interesting combo if you need both

scytale@piefed.zip on 06 Nov 22:48 collapse

It’s interesting that Filen mentions you might not be able to use the free starter plan if you’re on a VPN when you register. Wonder why they are keeping track of that? Abuse prevention maybe, but it’s weird they do it that way considering they sell a privacy-focused product.

BladeFederation@piefed.social on 06 Nov 16:51 collapse

Tresorit

PushButton@lemmy.world on 06 Nov 17:00 next collapse

Please remove Mailfence from the list.

I am using them, they are great, you can use your own domain, alias, webcal, with document space too, and cheap…

Please, I want it to stay smol and good.

Not all publicity is good publicity I’ve learnt…

Imnebuddy@lemmy.ml on 06 Nov 17:03 next collapse

Something that keeps being missed in these posts that I would recommend is Forward Email and NymVPN. For self-hosted email, I have also seen Stalwart recommended.

lemming@sh.itjust.works on 06 Nov 19:18 next collapse

Just a question, is there anything wrong with just KeePass?

bananabread@lemmy.zip on 06 Nov 20:02 next collapse

No, but you need to backup/sync it yourself

lemming@sh.itjust.works on 06 Nov 21:01 collapse

I meant non-XC KeePass. You have to back up XC manually as well. But I think I saw someone saying something bad about KeePass without XC or DX and I’m curious now.

clmbmb@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 07 Nov 05:59 collapse

KeePass is proprietary. KeePassXC is open source. I have experience with both and I find XC much better in many ways.

lemming@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 09:26 collapse

Thanks. I’m so used to KeePass that I just can’t get used to XC. I don’t like keeping the database open. I’m OK with XC on laptop with fingerprint reader, but on desktop, it just feels unwieldy. Also, I like to manually synchronize files between devices, because then they act as backup. And I can’t run syncthing at work.

sonstwas@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 12:15 collapse

But in that regard KeePass and XC work the same? Both just use the DB and lock if want them to lock…

lemming@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 21:06 collapse

I guess? Somehow i missed the autotype in XC before, maybe? I just checked it, switched to comapst mode and briefly tested and other than synchronisation of 2 databases, it ses to work mostly as I want to (better in some ways, maybe, more testing needed). And there’s Merge from database, which by the sound of it might do the synchronisation the way I want to. I will test it more! It looks like it might work for me too. Thank you!

FineCoatMummy@sh.itjust.works on 06 Nov 19:35 next collapse

Anybody know what the deal is for encrypted mail between mailbox.org and proton?

I’m looking to shift my proton over to mailbox. But I have lots of friends on proton, mostly b/c I recommended them to! And realistically, I am not gonna convince them all to move again. Some have onyl been on proton a few months.

I think proton-to-proton email is E2EE. I’m wondering if various others like mailbox that use pgp under the covers, cooperate to pgp between themselves too. Am I losing anything, if my friends stay on proton and I move to mailbox?

Email server to server might be TLS-ed most of the time anymore. But that’s not E2E.

ryper@lemmy.ca on 06 Nov 19:51 collapse

Proton has a page on How to use PGP with Proton Mail, including instructions for using it when emailing non-Proton accounts. If your friends follow that and you setup PGP properly in mailbox it should all work.

CH3DD4R_G0BL1N@sh.itjust.works on 06 Nov 19:58 next collapse

I don’t see Mozilla Thundermail making any of these lists, so if there are concerns, this is the place to say why. It’s still beta, but I got my invitation only 2 days after asking, so I’d say it’s viable in that regard.

StumblingWasabi@lemmy.today on 06 Nov 20:34 collapse

Looks like they became an advertiser via acquisition of anonym, removed the “we don’t sell your data” promise and switched from claiming “the best privacy” to “always protected” and updated their privacy policy, although the article I read didn’t cover what specific problems were introduced, just said that it was concerning. source

TwiddleTwaddle@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 06 Nov 21:14 next collapse

Thunderbird is technically separated from Mozilla to my understanding

CH3DD4R_G0BL1N@sh.itjust.works on 06 Nov 21:36 collapse

Great wiki resource, thanks.

SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml on 06 Nov 20:54 next collapse

i had enough struggle to convince my friends to switch away from google, im sure as hell not getting them to switch again. especially not when i am the one paying for the family subscription

iamthetot@piefed.ca on 06 Nov 21:09 next collapse

I’m confused… If you’re the one paying for it, why do you need to convince them of anything? They can come along or pay for their own services.

SaltyIceteaMaker@lemmy.ml on 06 Nov 21:32 collapse

it was unfortunately worded. the reason they switched at all is because im paying. if i stop paxing they will just switch back

iamthetot@piefed.ca on 06 Nov 23:16 collapse

That’s their prerogative.

Dave@lemmy.nz on 07 Nov 00:04 collapse

I think it’s fine. Proton is still better than big tech. I want to move away from Proton for myself but that’s because I am not tied to an address (custom domain) and am happy to do the switch. I would still encourage Proton over big tech for regular people. We do the best we can do.

Dave@lemmy.nz on 07 Nov 00:09 next collapse

I recently made a post asking for email providers, and no one has yet mentioned Mailfence, I hadn’t heard of it until seeing this post. What are people’s thoughts on it?

rhythmisaprancer@quokk.au on 07 Nov 11:33 collapse

I posted about it in another recent thread. Long time user and I am happy. But I only use some features despite paying. They historically had free accounts, too, but unsure what they offer now.

Dave@lemmy.nz on 07 Nov 11:36 collapse

They still have free accounts. I tried to sign up, to do so I needed to enter a backup email. I used a simplelogin one and now I’m blocked and have to wait 24 hours to try again 🤦

rhythmisaprancer@quokk.au on 07 Nov 11:42 collapse

Interesting! I tried creating a new account with my mailfence email and it just told me no. There was a point where I experienced places balking at me using that domain, perhaps they have had to tighten up registration.

Dave@lemmy.nz on 07 Nov 22:26 collapse

Oh also it kept telling me my selected username was invalid, while giving no indication as to why. In the end I think it was because it had the word “host” in it (actually, it was “ghost”, but apparently they don’t allow “host”).

I’ve tried again with a different recovery email and it still said no, please contact support. But I couldn’t find a link to contact support, only a knowledgebase, so I’m probably going to go with mailbox.org instead. I have created a trial account there without issue.

decended_being@midwest.social on 07 Nov 00:15 next collapse

What ever happened to Tuta mail? Is that bad?

es_eskaliert@feddit.org on 07 Nov 08:28 next collapse

What’s the thing with ChiPass vs KeepassXC?

sonstwas@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 12:10 collapse

No idea, but the chip ass (this was autocorrected but I’ll leave it :D) repo seems like a clone of KeepassXC…

WhatsHerBucket@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 08:38 next collapse

I would recommend doing a little more research into Mullvad and not rule it completely. I had the same stance until recently when someone pointed out a few facts.

The Örebro party is actually pretty interesting. Most of thier policies are pretty reasonable and forward thinking. Other countries would love to have some of the things they are advocating for (shorter work weeks, free public transport, and lower politician salaries, to name a few).

Just because one of the founders donated his own money to the organization doesn’t mean the company as a whole supports it.

Many of the VPNs being suggested may not have founders with crazy political views, but in my experience and other research, they are either extremely slow or have very few servers.

I will be switching to Mullvad in the very near future.

DPEWGF@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 09:55 next collapse

Ah yes, remigration & calling nonwhite migrants “parasites” is quite forward thinking.

It’s still money that came from the profits of the VPN. A very substantial amount too. I’d like for you to reconsider the VPN choice if possible.

HereIAm@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 11:48 collapse

Literally Hitler wasn’t that bad of a person. He was a huge animal rights activist, he spent a lot of time and money improving Germany’s transport infrastructure, and let’s not forget all the scientific strides under his leadership! /s

peaceful_world_view@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 11:45 next collapse

I can’t switch again, for the love of god(s) I’m old and tired.

ABetterTomorrow@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 14:49 next collapse

I’m going to give Mozilla’s new mail service a try next weekend. I think it’s called thundermail or thinderbirdmail.

echedeylr@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 07 Nov 19:33 next collapse

replace KeePassXC with ChiPass, which is a fork without AI

pirate2377@lemmy.zip on 08 Nov 03:07 next collapse

Fun fact about KeepassXC: it also supports 2FA (via manually inserting totp tokens), so you could argue it’s also an alternative to Proton Authenticator assuming you don’t mind having your TOTP tokens and passwords are in the same place. Though I will say having them in the same place is at least better than not having 2FA at all, so it’s an option to consider

helpImTrappedOnline@lemmy.world on 08 Nov 16:00 collapse

If you’re worried about it you could also have a seperate file for 2fa, different passwords. The embedded file and notes features are great for storing the backup/recovery codes good 2fa implementations give you.

Kory@lemmy.ml on 08 Nov 09:21 next collapse

I don’t think you want to include Windscribe: retro.social/@ifixcoinops/117526586958025535

inlandempire@jlai.lu on 08 Nov 09:59 collapse

aaaaaand one more to remove, thanks for the heads up

Eggman@thelemmy.club on 09 Nov 00:04 collapse

Tuta had honeypot allegations. gizmodo.com/tuta-email-denies-connection-to-intel…